Sail Trim etc.

[Tom G P 21]

What one person mention about the bolt rope shrinking is a possibility. I released the bolt rope on my 30 year old sails and gained about 8 inches. How old are your sails? When you get a chance measure the luff and see if it has shrunk. Below is a link to Stingy Sailor that explains how to release the bolt rope. It gave me a couple of more years before I finally bought new sails.

https://stingysailor.com/2015/09/12/how-to-breathe-new-life-into-that-baggy-old-sail-2/

[tjspiel]

What one person mention about the bolt rope shrinking is a possibility. I released the bolt rope on my 30 year old sails and gained about 8 inches. How old are your sails? When you get a chance measure the luff and see if it has shrunk. Below is a link to Stingy Sailor that explains how to release the bolt rope. It gave me a couple of more years before I finally bought new sails.

https://stingysailor.com/2015/09/12/how-to-breathe-new-life-into-that-baggy-old-sail-2/

You might have pointed that article out to me a few years ago because I used it when I lengthened the bolt rope on my main. I also added a leech line.

I eventually got new sails but like for you, it added a couple of more years to the mainsail I had. Fixing the bolt rope allowed me to get the sail flatter and when reefed the shape actually wasn't too bad.

[Dave Scobie]

At the point you are releasing the bolt rope and then sail shape is better reefed all is really lost for sailing well, especially upwind.

Kinda like having a care where you pull into gas station to fill the oil and check the gas.

[tjspiel]

At the point you are releasing the bolt rope and then sail shape is better reefed all is really lost for sailing well, especially upwind.

Kinda like having a care where you pull into gas station to fill the oil and check the gas.

Yeah, releasing the bolt rope doesn't make it into a new sail again. I see it more like a knee replacement when you've also got a bad shoulder and your eyesight isn't what it used to be.

That new knee isn't going to bring your 90 mph fastball back, but at least you'll be able to walk to the mound a little easier.

In high winds the old sail was like a big bag and the leech would flap noisily in any kind of breeze. So my fixes made it a bit better when there was some wind. And it wasn't as awful when reefed.

Also since it was an old sail I wasn't worried about ruining it with my novice sewing skills. What I learned doing that work helped me convert a newer hank-on jib to one I could use with a furler and I'm pretty happy with how that turned out.

What I *really* wanted was a new sail but my boat budget is limited to mad money so that had to wait for a couple more seasons. I agree that if you're in a position to buy a new sail, fixing the bolt rope on an old one may not make a lot of sense.

[JimInVA]

Howdy Guys,
I hope my tech inadequacies don't mess it up, but I plan to make the PSHH tonight. I am going to try to get pictures on here from last Saturday's sail. Great steady wind and fairly cool and dry for August. Wind slowed down after about the first hour and a half, but we needed to head in anyway for an afternoon dinner at the neighbor's. Probably the best sail of the summer (only got the boat in the drink in mid July).
You'll see from the photos that I have a fixed gooseneck. I can yank down on my main halyard for all I'm worth (about 215 lbs and a biscuit) and this is the best I can do with the luff. Not sure if this sail has a lot more left even if I tried the bolt rope trick.
Good news is, my wife was admiring the nice new sails on another larger boat sailing near us (nice tight luff and shape, with the sacrificial blue sunbrella material on the roller furler). I may not have too tough a sales (sails) job to talk her into an upgrade. That discussion will be for a different thread. Here are You cannot view this attachment.You cannot view this attachment.You cannot view this attachment.You cannot view this attachment.    the photos if I can make this work. Be talking to you guys soon. 😀
Jim

[Riggerdood]

Hi Jim,

Sorry we missed you at happy hour - please see my reply to your PM.

As to your main luff issue, there is still plenty of hoist available at the top of the mast, so something is preventing you from being able to reach full hoist. Can't really tell from the photos what that might be though?

[JimInVA]

Yep. I realize now that I had the start time wrong. Happy Hour on the east coast starts earlier. Maybe that's the reason for my bad math 😁!
I have felt all along that my mainsail was not going all the way up. Seems to be 6-8" from the top of the mast. Not sure what I can do about it without lowering the mast and that is quite an ordeal. Getting the mast up and down safely and efficiently is my main obstacle to being a true "trailersailor."
I will try some wiggling and other very scientific techniques next time I bring her up and down to see if I can get the sail all the way up. There is a bit of a binding feel to the halyard as she gets towards the top of the mast. Not sure if some kind of track lube would help. I don't see any knots or fraying on the halyard.
One of these days I'll get to chat with you guys. Hope you had a good Happy Hour!
Jim

[Brian N.]

Jim - I had the same thoughts as Tim, looks as if you're not getting the sail to the top. Lube might help, but something tells me it is another issue. I would first take the sail off and inspect the entire luff and the slides. Unfortunately, lowering the mast, although a pain, is the only way you'll get a good look at it.

[Riggerdood]

Yep. I realize now that I had the start time wrong. Happy Hour on the east coast starts earlier. Maybe that's the reason for my bad math 😁!
I have felt all along that my mainsail was not going all the way up. Seems to be 6-8" from the top of the mast. Not sure what I can do about it without lowering the mast and that is quite an ordeal. Getting the mast up and down safely and efficiently is my main obstacle to being a true "trailersailor."
I will try some wiggling and other very scientific techniques next time I bring her up and down to see if I can get the sail all the way up. There is a bit of a binding feel to the halyard as she gets towards the top of the mast. Not sure if some kind of track lube would help. I don't see any knots or fraying on the halyard.
One of these days I'll get to chat with you guys. Hope you had a good Happy Hour!
Jim

Jim, 5:00 PM Pacific (my time here in SoCal) is the earliest I can start the PSHH, so I make sure the announcements clearly reflect 5 PM PST/8 PM EST. It's only 40 minutes, so an 8:00 Eastern start time for the East coast folks has been manageable so far for most. Hope to see you next time!

[tjspiel]

FWIW, my bolt rope had shrunk a good 6 to 8 inches which could be part of the reason why you're not able to get the top of the sail much higher, - though it looks like from the pic that there's a couple of inches worth of slack in the bolt rope.

I can't see a cringle for a Cunningham but that may be due to the angle of the photos.

Are all your battens in place and the right length?

If your wife is open to the idea of getting new sails I'd go for it. A friend of mine had some tanbark sails made and they are gorgeous. He's got the right boat for them though. Not sure they'd look as nice on a Precision. You cannot view this attachment.

[Tom G P 21]

Looking at the sails again, I agree I think your bolt rope shrunk. Like I said in my previous post it's a band aid. New sails would make a world of difference. Also it looks like you are missing a sail slug. One other thing is to think about is adding a dog bone to make it easier to reef. Two rings tied together with strapping through the reef grommet to hook on to the reef hook.

[Brian S]

As far as the full height mainsail hoist, remember that prior to hoisting the main, make sure that the mainsheet and the vang are let off. If your mainsheet or vang is tight, it will hold the leech tight, preventing you from getting full hoist.

And, of course, a shrunken bolt rope can keep that luff looking slack.

[talbot]

I think the P18/21/23 do not use main luff downhauls. You would need a Cunningham eye in the sail. In general, I think PBW did not give us enough sail controls. They feel you can do everything with main sheet tension and vang. I respectfully disagree, although I have to say a Cunningham is just about the only control I have not added. Next year. My new main has a place for it; I just never installed the line.