Jib tracks and making a million little holes in the cabin top

[tjspiel]

The old P-18s had the jib blocks mounted in a fixed position, no cars or tracks. And it really didn't bug me until I got a new jib, - especially now that it furls.

But it's tough to get good trim so I've decided to bite the bullet. You might remember James Steele whose P-18 was crushed by snow. He's parting the boat out and still had the tracks so I'm going to buy them from him.

What I'm not looking forward to is making all the holes, filling them with epoxy, etc.

He removed a lot of the hardware from the boat by cutting the fiberglass around it with a sawszall rather than removing all the nuts and bolts. Not sure he'll ship the tracks that way but I'm curious to see how Precision prepared the holes.

This project might wait until Fall because it's going to take some time,- and I'll probably have some questions for you all.

[DBthal]

Tom,

The biggest problem with the drilling & prepping holes to mount hardware on a Precision is the "monkey fur" on the inside of the cabin. It wraps on the drill bit and makes it more difficult to seal the holes for filling with epoxy.

When the time comes, I can show you what I did.

Dan

[Brian N.]

Just in case I would give Bill at Precision a call. I would ask if the cabin top profile has changed between older and newer models, and any "secrets" he may have about drilling and mounting.

[DBthal]

Just a thought... I wonder if Barber Haulers would do the job with less drilling?
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From "Fast is Fun" an article by by Dave Bacon [Illustrations by Stu Whitcomb]

[Riggerdood]

Dan, I was always under the impression that barber haulers were for pulling the sheets closer to the center of the boat, between the clew and the block? This is the stbd one on the DS. The track/block is just out of frame at the bottom, on the inside of the coaming. There isn't really anywhere to put them on the RS22, that and the sheets run outside of the shrouds, so they would rub.

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[Brian S]

Regarding holes for track, on the track I installed on my O'day this year, the holes were sized to fit 1/4" bolts which was a Good Thing™️. This allowed me to use the pictured Dremel tool to cut back the core material. The tool is 1/4" diameter, so fits into the hole, and then the fins will undercut the core. Makes it easy to fill with thickened epoxy and then redrill 1/4" holes and have the core all sealed up. Don't forget to countersink all the holes so that your sealant of choice has more surface area between fiberglass and fastener to make a good, long-lasting seal. I tried to use 1/4" doweling to plug the bottom of the hole when pouring in the epoxy (using a syringe) but then decided to just nip back the carpet liner with sharp 6" dykes, giving me enough fiberglass area for some Gorilla brand duct tape to stick. Besides, I used fender washers, so less liner compressed under was better. I sorta dreaded the job, but honestly it went way easier than I expected once I just got into it, so no complaints. Also, I still didn't install the track end caps, because they don't use 1/4" fasteners, so my Dremel trick doesn't work to seal the core. I would like the look of the caps better, but functionally it's not an issue unless someone lets the car to the end of the track and it falls off, or if someone decides to casually remove them from the boat at the dock or something...

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[DBthal]

Looks good Brian!

[Riggerdood]

Slick method Brian. Rum Line's tracks have never had end caps, and it's never been an issue. Even if the car were to come off the track, it would remain captive between the clew and the cam cleat.

[Scooter]

FWIW I used a $7.99 'Diamond' hole saw set from amazon to cut the headliner when I replaced the grab and companionway rails. They made nice round holes and didn't fray the headliner too much. It worked much better than dykes or a razor blade and was easily covered by a flat washer.

[Brian S]

Being pedantic about barber haulers...

I've always heard about barber haulers referring to pulling the sheet (and clew) inwards.

But also "twings" for pulling down. I've seen this primarily on spinnaker sheets, where a ring is tied to a line, and you can quickly pull down on the guy (lazy sheet) instead of having to do something like hook the guy into a reaching hook on deck.

So, I suppose if you didn't want to put jib track down, you could run twings. I think for racing, it's not used because it's more difficult to see where to set it than jib track. With track, you know exactly where the sheet goes from deck to the clew, but with a twing pulling down from only one spot you'd have to figure where that should be such that you get full range, and also imagine where the line of the sheet would go from clew, through ring, and extend back to where it intersects the deck. Too fiddly for me compared to jib track. Even towable cars on track would be easier to set and see where they go. I guess this is why you'd use a twing on a spinnaker guy, because it's either on or off.

[tjspiel]

All the hole drilling/filling tips have been great. So has the discussion about barber haulers and twings.

When I bought my boat the previous owner showed me how he rigged the jib. He actually ran the sheets through what are supposed to be the blocks for a genoa. But before getting to those blocks the sheets were run through these little loops of line tied to a stanchion base. Someone on this forum described them as low budget "twings" when I posted a picture.

Then I was told that the way the jib was rigged was all wrong and that the sheets are supposed to run between the shrouds.

But now I understand why he did it that way. With that arrangement you can get the clue both down and back farther than you can with the fixed cabin top blocks. The downside is that the clue ends up further outboard.

Since I probably won't install the tracks until Fall, I might try that twing arrangement again to see how the jib looks.