Downwind steering tips

[talbot]

On a fast (7.8 kt) downwind run this week, I had a tough time keeping my winged-out jib lined up. I didn't want to sail by the lee for fear of a gybe, but if I headed up the slightest bit, the jib would deflate. As soon as I steered down, it would snap to full with a bang, and the whole rig would shudder. I ended up just staring at the windex atop the mast, trying to keep it centered. Literally a pain in the neck. Anyone have any tips for handling a boat smoothly in those conditions?

[Riggerdood]

Sounds like you could use a whisker pole Talbot?

[tjspiel]

Yes, a whisker pole, - and maybe a preventer to help prevent an accidental jibe.

Dead down wind is not a favorite point of sail for me, especially in high wind and waves. Waves pushing the boat around or a wind shift can lead to trouble.

[Brian N.]

Dead down wind is a balancing on the P165, and I tend to sail a few points up, and still head sail trim is tricky. Moving the jib cars fore and aft varies with wind angle, wind strength, halyard tension and jib sheet trim. Even after years sailing my boat, I can not say with any conviction the correct way to trim, except in generalities, of which I'm sure you're familiar with.

[talbot]

Whisker pole. Great! Excuse to buy more equipment.

Question: How do you determine where to mount the whisker pole fitting on the mast? Could you use the same point for both a WP or a spinnaker pole?

[Riggerdood]

The rule of thumb I've always heard is to mount the fitting on the mast in such a way that the pole is perpendicular to the mast when set. Can't tell you whether or not that would be the correct point for a spin pole, as I've only ever flown assyms.

[Shesaidno]

You can make your own whisker pole pretty easily and inexpensively with a painter's extension pole and some basic hardware. My homemade pole for my P165 is much heavier then my purchased marine store pole, helping to keep the jib or genoa down better. If it's too windy for wing on wing, I furl in the jib as much as necessary or go for a broad reach. I don't have a preventer, but that seems to make good sense too. 

[Riggerdood]

One way to do a quick and easy preventer is, if your boat has stanchions and a vang, tie a line to the vang boom bail, lead it down through a stanchion base, then aft. Tie it off with a quick release slip knot to something within easy reach of the helm, or put it into a cam cleat, because you want to be able to release it very quickly if the main gets backwinded.

[talbot]

Not sure of that attachment point. Practical Sailor reviewed some recent preventer failures, like the one off Fiji that resulted in the loss of the boat and two crew members. Having the boom attachment forward on the boom gives the sail tremendous mechanical advantage over the preventer--enough to break lines or pull fittings out of the deck. I would think it safer to attach midboom or aft.

[Quantico Frank]

I really like the idea of a preventer, but I'm concerned about the amount of rigging required for a small boat like a P165. Any of you P165'ers using a preventer in a configuration you like?

[Riggerdood]

Not sure of that attachment point. Practical Sailor reviewed some recent preventer failures, like the one off Fiji that resulted in the loss of the boat and two crew members. Having the boom attachment forward on the boom gives the sail tremendous mechanical advantage over the preventer--enough to break lines or pull fittings out of the deck. I would think it safer to attach midboom or aft.

Yeah, that could be the case. Mind you, I've not tried the method myself, just one that I remembered reading about.

[Riggerdood]

I really like the idea of a preventer, but I'm concerned about the amount of rigging required for a small boat like a P165. Any of you P165'ers using a preventer in a configuration you like?

On my DS, it was simply a quick release snap shackle with a pull lanyard, attached to an eyestrap on the boom. Snap it to a shroud and voila.

[Brian S]

Sailing dead downwind can be a real pain. It tends to be a light wind solo kinda thing for me. This means I have to be somewhat forward in the cockpit, actively playing the jib sheet to try and keep the jib full and drawing if I don't feel like putting up the whisker pole. Even so, it does get annoying as it starts to collapse, letting out the sheet and pulling back in, trying to keep the jib out and inflated. If I had crew, I'd probably sit them on the cabin holding the sheet out farther than the fairlead, lessening the chance it will collapse. Or, they could be bowman and set the whisker pole. One time during a race up the lake, we had strong, pretty consistent DDW winds, and I found the jib was much happier staying out fully wing on wing. That was a FAST run. I had fun holding off a Hunter 23 in my smaller O'day 192.

Anyway, with a little bit more wind from the right direction, I will sometimes try to sail a deep reach, and gybe my way downwind. Sometimes it's a bit of a fine line between the jib and main drawing well in a deep reach, and the jib being blanketed by the main.

When I do sail DDW wing on wing, I tend to stand in the cockpit staring up at the masthead wind indicator to prevent sailing by the lee and crash gybes. I find my boat is fairly forgiving, giving me a decent warning before she starts trying to gybe on her own.